Legislature(2007 - 2008)BUTROVICH 205

05/08/2007 03:30 PM Senate JUDICIARY


Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ SB 172 EXTEND BOARD OF GOVERNORS ABA TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ HB 121 WORKERS' COMPENSATION RECORDS TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 121(L&C)am Out of Committee
+ HB 175 EMINENT DOMAIN / FISHING WATERWAYS TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 175(JUD)am Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
           HB 175 - EMINENT DOMAIN/FISHING WATERWAYS                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:17:50 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR FRENCH announced  the consideration of HB  175. [Before the                                                               
committee was CSHB 175(JUD) am.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:17:57 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  CRAIG  JOHNSON,  sponsor  of HB  175,  said  last                                                               
year's eminent domain bill was  a direct response to an egregious                                                               
case in Connecticut  where some homes were taken  to increase the                                                               
tax rolls  of a city. He  said 75 homes were  actually taken, and                                                               
the same thing  could have happen in Alaska.  The legislation has                                                               
become  a model  for  real estate  communities.  "We protected  a                                                               
person's  primary  residence  from being  confiscated  …  through                                                               
eminent domain  within a radius  of 250 feet." This  bill doesn't                                                               
change that but extends the  two-hundred fifty foot protection to                                                               
permanent recreational structures. The  bill still allows for the                                                               
legitimate use  of eminent  domains for  projects such  as roads,                                                               
hospitals, schools,  public buildings,  gas pipelines,  and other                                                               
legitimate undertakings  of the government. He  said the greatest                                                               
use of property is "to be  in a private person's hands." The bill                                                               
prohibits  taking   recreational  property  for   a  recreational                                                               
purpose.  He  said  the  bill  has  been  amended  to  allow  the                                                               
Department  of Fish  and Game  (ADF&G) to  inventory streams  and                                                               
determine  if there  is land  that  can be  purchased to  provide                                                               
access. But there is no use of eminent domain for that.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:21:41 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR FRENCH  said he thinks the  bill is well balanced  with the                                                               
two provisions.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  THERRIAULT asked  for clarification  that the  bill just                                                               
adds recreational structures.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON   said  yes,   but  structures   must  be                                                               
permanent such  as fishing or  hunting cabins, and there  must be                                                               
clear title. It wouldn't be a tent that moves around on a lot.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR FRENCH said  the 250-foot limit doesn't  give carte blanche                                                               
protection.   If  a   government  agency   decided  to   build  a                                                               
recreational facility  on someone's  10-acre plot, it  would have                                                               
to be 250 feet away from a cabin.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON  said that's correct. The  radius provides                                                               
for about three acres.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR FRENCH said this bill wouldn't stop a gas pipeline.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  said it  would  not;  he has  been  very                                                               
careful to  protect the legitimate  uses of eminent  domain while                                                               
honoring private property.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:24:20 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR THERRIAULT asked for more  information on Section 4, page                                                               
3, line  21, referring to  "at least two  and not more  than five                                                               
meander miles along a fishing waterway."                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:24:48 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked Representative  Gara to speak to his                                                               
amendment and noted his support for the amendment.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LES GARA said "meander  mile" is a linear distance                                                               
along  a fishing  stream.  The goal  is to  see  how much  public                                                               
access might be lost in the  most important access spots, and not                                                               
to inventory  every piece of  private property around  the state.                                                               
He noted Montana  Creek, north of Anchorage, where  there is over                                                               
a mile  of private land that  will impede public access.  He gave                                                               
other  examples. He  wants the  agencies to  see how  much public                                                               
access might be lost in the  most important areas. "We don't want                                                               
them  to put  together a  list of  50 miles  worth of  stuff that                                                               
they'll never  buy, so  we cap  it at  5 miles  for the  list. We                                                               
don't want  them to ignore  the bill and  not do anything,  so we                                                               
say the minimum should about 2 miles."                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR THERRIAULT  asked if all  river access would  be included                                                               
by this bill.  He noted the cabins on the  Salcha River and said,                                                               
"I don't  know if right now  that people feel like  access to the                                                               
Salcha River is getting close to being cut off."                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARA said  the reason for the five-mile  cap is to                                                               
give ADF&G  and DNR  the ability to  identify the  most important                                                               
places where  public access  may be lost.  Access is  pretty good                                                               
now,  and people  aren't kicking  anyone off  their property.  He                                                               
spoke of undeveloped  CIRI lands along some rivers.  The point is                                                               
to buy easements from landowners who  want to sell while the land                                                               
is undeveloped  rather than  waiting for  the conflicts  and when                                                               
land is too expensive to buy.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR THERRIAULT asked if purchased  property or easements must                                                               
be at least five miles.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARA replied no; the  two to five miles don't have                                                               
to be on a  single river. It could be 100 yards  on one river and                                                               
800  yards on  another. "You  want  them to  total somewhere,  at                                                               
least around  two miles, and  we know  that there's at  least two                                                               
miles."   He  said  all of  Gibraltar Creek  by  Lake Iliamna  is                                                               
barred to the public, and there are others.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:28:46 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if this is  a problem in the Lower 48,                                                               
and if  the intent is to  purchase small segments here  and there                                                               
to ensure  the public has an  easement or access to  a particular                                                               
stream or river.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARA  said it depends  on the stream. If  he could                                                               
he  would take  an  important stream  and try  to  buy an  access                                                               
corridor for  the two  miles that the  public uses  everyday now,                                                               
but won't be  able to use twenty years from  now. Some rivers may                                                               
be so  deep that  only one  access point is  needed. Now,  in the                                                               
Lower 48, a person may need a lot of money to be able to fish.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR McGUIRE  said she supports Representative  Gara's part of                                                               
the  bill.   Families  that  may   not  have  the  means   for  a                                                               
recreational cabin should have the  same ability to enjoy Alaska.                                                               
This is a  forward thinking approach to how the  public can enjoy                                                               
recreational opportunities in the state.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:31:58 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  FRENCH asked  what  the  public is  allowed  do along  the                                                               
riverfront of a private property.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARA  said current state  law allows access  up to                                                               
the  high water  mark, even  if there  is no  easement. When  the                                                               
state  gives  away lands,  it  retains  public access  along  the                                                               
rivers.  Many lands  that are  in private  hands don't  have that                                                               
access, and  the stream bank  is private. If  it were an  area of                                                               
important public access the state may  offer to buy a strip along                                                               
the river. But an owner would not be obliged to sell.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR THERRIAULT noted that mean  high water is often above the                                                               
river, so a person may be able to walk on a bank.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARA said  that is  the current  law, but  no one                                                               
really knows  where mean high water  is. But you would  want more                                                               
than  that narrow  strip.  The agencies  will  likely target  the                                                               
undeveloped land-it will be cheaper and have fewer conflicts.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:35:00 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON said  once a  property owner  declines to                                                               
sell, the property is taken off the list.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARA  said that  was from a  former bill,  but the                                                               
reality is that a person will not be frequently contacted.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
RUTH  BLACKWELL, Associate  Broker, Powell  Realty, Juneau,  said                                                               
she is representing  the Alaska Association of  Realtors, and she                                                               
is pleased  with last year's  bill and  wants passage of  HB 175.                                                               
She is neutral on the second part of the bill, however.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:37:17 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI motioned  to report  CSHB 175(JUD)  am from                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations  and attached  fiscal                                                               
note(s). There being no objections, it was so ordered.                                                                          

Document Name Date/Time Subjects